Skerry Sail modifications

I am getting ready for the spring and summer sailing season with my Skerry. I currently have the balanced lug sail.

I want to free up some space in the middle while under sail as well as make transport and set up quicker. I am considering a few modifications, please help me understand the pros and cons and any sugestions.

It roughly goes from most to least likely to happen

Have a cleat for the Main Sheet

  • When going on a single tack for a long time my hands get tiered. It would be nice to have a cleat and maybe a better ratio. Anyone have this for the skerry or similar?

Have a way to lock the tiller

  • If I need to move forward while underway to manage the lines, get a sandwich, help a kid I have to try and play a odd game
  • lashing it doesn't seem to work and I worry that I might need a quick release

Move the Main Sheet point further aft to the back bench

  • I don't know about this one
  • The idea would be to free the middle bench where I sit more often, or where the kids sit when with me.
  • I would want it far enough aft that I can still sit on the windward side of the bench

Might Happen

 

Rig up the mast to fold up and down

  • It would be nice if I could pull off the cover, raise the mast, and put in the water in less than 10 min
  • I would plan on building a beefy block that locks into the current mast step (for the balanced lug)
  • The mast unaltered would then fit into a mast step that folds and locks with pins
  • I could rig at home or leave it rigged after sailing and just pop up the mast
  • It would make the cover drain better
  • This would likley make the mast about 12-18in taller than designed

Maybe Next Year

Use goosnecks to turn the balanced lug into a gaff rig, add a jib/genoa 

  • This is unlikely to happen
  • Last year I had two situations, one where I needed a bit more power and one where I wanted quite a bit less
  • The jib would likely have a furrler and I have an idea to make one myself
  • the stay could be used to help the folding mast.
  • I am worried that there are performance considerations as the sail plan for the sloop rig (of which this would be a strange cousin) looks different
  • would I also need to put shrouds on for the spruce mast
  • Is the current mast enough if I also finish it with fiberglass or carbon

A forward drop in stowage compartment for long jouneys

  • It would be nice to camp on board
  • it would be nice to organize storage on longer outings instead of it rolling around
  • It would be nice to have some boxes to keep the lines tidy
  • If capsized it would be nice if I didn't have to collect everything (hasn't happened yet, but it may
  • Additional flotation
  • I would make a drop in section that matches the forward section, curves and all.
  • It would lock in place but also be removable.
  • two watertight lockers one to port and one to starbord (possibly one insulated with a plug)
  • cup holder
  • Possibly light electronics for radio, charging, and night running lights

10 replies:

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RE: Skerry Sail modifications

Do NOT cleat the mainsheet. In a boat the size of the Skerry that's a real good way to get experience doing capsize recoveries.

Instead, use a ratchet block. It provides the required tension and relieves your arm, but can be instantly released at need. You can use 2 blocks, one ratcheted, one not, to get a better purchase.

Laszlo

 

RE: Skerry Sail modifications

   Laszlo,

As always a wealth of wisdom!

Ironic that one of my main concerns was that tying off would also send me for a swim. (I put that in the tiller question though)

I have not really used rachet blocks in the past, now that I (know they are a thing) look at them on harken this looks like the ticket.

Do you have any ideas on freeing up the mainsheet line from the middle bench?

RE: Skerry Sail modifications

   Another 2 cents:

I agree with Laszlo - to a point - on cleating the main.  A ratchet block makes a huge difference, I use one on my NE Dory.  The best place for the ratchet block is the last turn - after leaving the block the line should go next iimmediately into your hand (or to the mainsheet cleat (see below). It is nice to have a selectable on-off ratchet block, or one that ratchets only when under tension.  An "always-on" block can become a pain (PITA) in light air.

I think that in some conditions and for some reasons it is nice to free up the extra hand that otherwise has to hold the main sheet continuously, which you must do even with a ratchet block. My solutions is that I put a jam cleat on both the port and starboard side of the boat (you'll have to choose most convenient location). A jam cleat has one regular horn and one V-shaped horn. The line wraps once (actually less than 360 degrees) around the cleat with no locking turn or anything like that. Release when needed is virtually instantaneous using an unwrapping motion. In many conditions I'm happy to use the cleat - steady winds, downwind, etc.. - it just makes sailing a bit more pleasant. Whenever worried about needing to constantly change sail trim - close hauled, gusty or very strong winds, etc.. you just don't use the jam cleat. Be careful how you orient the cleat - the round/smooth horn should be basically opposite/on the back side of the direction from which the tensioned line will approach the cleat. Sometimes you might find that you decide to keep a hold the mainsheet and not wrap around the jam horn - the extra friction of a partial wrap under the smooth horn is enough to make holding the sheet a non-issue.

Do whatever works best for you with respect to mainsheet blocks to get desired reduction in mainsheet tension.  I think a 3:1 ratio is probably sufficent in the Skerry. Do consider that each turn does require a lot more sheet length to be let in/out for an equivalent abount of trim motion. If you rig from the aft end of the boom, you can end up needing a very long sheet to let the boom all the way out when running.

The boom on the Skerry should be more than strong enough to rig the mainsheet completely from the aft end, should you desire to do so.  You might consider putting a bridle across the boat just forward of the rear seat, with a block attached there, either running side to side or fixed in the middle. Then rig the mainsheet thus: tie to the aft end of boom (or to attachment point on fiddle-block on aft end of boom), down through block on bridle, up through block on aft end of boom, forward along boom (you choose the distance), through ratched block, then down to hand (or jam cleat).

I haven't figured out a good way to temporarily tie off the tiller on these designs. Using a short line permanently tied to the side of the boat, and then using the loose end to take several loose half-hitches on the tiller handle has been my solution.  I only put the line on when I want to tie the tiller off (which is rarely, usually when rowing), but the wraps/loose half hitches do allow sliding the tiller to a new position to easily adjust the rudder trim.

Good luck testing all your other ideas...

-Bubblehead

RE: Skerry Sail modifications

   Because I'm a stickler for nomenclature and realized I didn't get it just right in my wording above.

Regarding blocks: Becket block refers to a block that will have a fixed attachment point for the sheet line, fiddle block refers tor a block with more than one pulley/wheel (in-line with each other) of graduated different sizes.  And a fiddle block may also have a becket, but I digress.

Now here's a thing. I often use the smaller pulley of a fiddle bock as a becket (tie the fixed end of the sheet line around it in light air), then in heavy air actually employ the pulley to add one extra purchasing turn into the sheet by moving the fixed-end position of the line.

RE: Skerry Sail modifications

An alternative to the jam cleat is a cam cleat. Jam cleats usually work fine but I prefer the action of a cam cleat. Pull the line through to clamp it, lift the line to release it. It is pricier than a jam cleat, though.

I did, however, have a problem with a jam cleat on my Faering Cruiser. Long story short, the cockpit was swamped with the centerboard line in the jam cleat with the centerboard in the "up" position. The line soaked until the cockpit drained, absorbed water and swelled up to where I couldn't get it out of the jam cleat. So I ended up trying to sail off a lee shore with the centerboard up. Not much point in that, I can tell you. Once I got the line worked loose, I was able to put the board down. With a cam cleat, the swollen line still would have come loose.

Another situation where the cam cleat works better is if the line gets a knot in it while jammed. It will not go through the jam cleat but can still be release from a cam cleat by lifting up.

Jam

Cam 

Laszlo

 

RE: Skerry Sail modifications

   I'm talking a different style of jam cleat - not gonna bother with the time to post pictures, just links, but looks like a standard cleat with two horns, just that one horn has a rounded base, the other comes to a v-shape that helps to lock the line.  The deal is that they provide quite a large range of variability of the incoming sheet angle, don't capture the line, and are very quickly uncleated (you never do a figure 8 on these). And can be used without wrapping around the jam horn as a convenient way to add a bit of extra friction and prevent from having to pull down (hand-high) position, assuming the sheet is coming from a block on the boom to your hand.  You can take a turn under the round horn and easily hold a still free-running sheet with your hand low.  A very multi-functional and flexible rigging solution. Even a good place to cleat on fenders & etc. when not under sail. 

Because my boat is all traditional brass/bronze fittings, I'm using cleats like this: https://www.spartanmarine.com/all-products/jam-cleat 

Here are some other examples: 

https://www.amazon.com/Schaefer-Jamming-Anodized-Forged-Aluminum/dp/B00K3Y2PQU?source=ps-sl-shoppingads-lpcontext&ref_=fplfs&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

https://www.sailrite.com/Jam-Cleat?gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAjw_e2wBhAEEiwAyFFFozzBZ0Ycl9P4HMp3eEN4lgRoz0PTiKcJwE_sxWs-1brrJ4HqgYzRcRoCr8AQAvD_BwE 

 

The jam cleat Laszo pitures isn't ideal for a main sheet (or any sheet) as it captures the line and doesn't doesn't allow moving the sheet from side to side or easily taking it in hand when use of the cleat isn't desired.  You can get open top jam cleats like this that don't capture the line, but they are only good if the line always comes in from directly in "front" of the cleat. The cam cleat pictured isn't ideal for the Skerry, either, as without a capture fairlead a cam cleat is very particular that the line come from directly in front. And with a fairlead (which helps to PARTIALLY solve the incoming angle problem) the line is captured.

Getting a good rig set up will involve physically (or mentally) sitting in the boat, considering what bits and pieces you might use to complete the rigging, and mentally moving all the various bits and pieces around to parse out what will work. Then going through the same excercise again while considering other various hardware options. 

RE: Skerry Sail modifications

  Bubblehead's pictures:

 

 

RE: Skerry Sail modifications

Okay Okay, I hear you on the cleats and then you mention a bunch! Have my head wrapped around that.

I think I will do a 3:1 with a ratchet block and keep the location as is for now. Sail for another year or two with the main sheet change before continuing on with re-arraanging it.

Laszlo, I have been on a quest to not have to go all the way forward to mess with lines after sailing on a lake and nearly buying it. my halyard now goses all the way to the stern and is cam cleated with a fair number of guide holes and pullies to keep it out of the way and oriented right. I do like the cam cleats and if I feel the need to secure it more I use a pin set up with my spacered inwalls. Next up is organizing the rest of the lines!

I took a closer look at the french skerries that use a more traditional tiller. I know I can friction loop this well where it will move for me if I need but stay in place if I need to go forward. I will try out removable tiller that fits over the post and see if this works.

Question to you all, it might be bothersome at times, but would there be anything stopping me from using a jib(or genoa) with the Lug Rig? (I really want to run a bunch of lines back and have a million cam cleats!)

 

RE: Skerry Sail modifications

Not something I ever wanted, but here's someone who did it. You'd probably have to move the Skerry's mast.

I understand the need to play with string. My schooner made me realize that I was part cat. It also let me reconfigure for just about any wind.

Pictures enlarge when clicked.

Doryman's balanced lug/jib combo.

My 18-foot schooner with all lines lead to the cockpit.

Laszlo

 

RE: Skerry Sail modifications

There’s a way to ease the fatigue in your hand without spending a cent. Take a bend of sheet (undernand loop?) around the tiller and pinch it with your thumb. The friction of the sheet wrapping over itself takes most of the force. It also frees a hand to use your compass or whatever. There is almost no chance of fowling the line like any kind of cleat would have. Did I mention it’s free?

Adding a jib to your skerry:
For a jib to be the least bit effective it needs a lot of headstay tension. You’ll see Doryman’s rig has shrouds to counter the pull of the headstay. But, this eliminates one of the great benefits of the balance lug. Namely, the unstayed mast. In a pinch you can flag your sail (let the main part of the sail rotate forward of the mast). This is great for all kinds of downwind sailing. Shrouds would prevent this. What ever you might gain upwind with a jib you’d lose downwind. Plus, it’d take much longer at the ramp prepping the rig.

You are right in needing more strings to pull! More. Strings! The expedition skerry has a yawl version drawn, at least I think so. Here’s my NE Dory converted to a cat-yawl.

More strings, lies head to wind for reefing, looks salty, no shrouds, there are fun mizzen tricks to play with. Check with CLC about alternate rigs for the skerry.

Have a look here for refit to yawl Flickr page.

What ever sail you add will change the balance of the boat. You'll need to calculate the change in Center of Effort to Center of Lateral Resistance. Ms. Google should answer all CE/CLR calculation questions.

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