Hi SteveE914  

I have a lot of experience with epoxy over stained cedar.  I would enumerate the issues to think about below:

1. The main issue to be careful about is you must use a compatible stain – basically a stain that has no oil in it.   The mohawk/behlens brands on the website fit the bill.. https://www.clcboats.com/shop/products/boat-building-supplies-epoxy-fiberglass-plywood/boat-paint-varnish-finishing/mohawk-ultra-penetrating-stain.html.   I have also made my own alcohol based stain that worked just fine by following a recipe I found on the internet
2. The process of staining can take a bit of practice and planning to get a good result.  CLC has a good overview of the process at this link: https://www.clcboats.com/shoptips/finishing-tips/staining-your-kayak.html  and if you are trying to do things like preserve a line or contrast, a lot of care is needed.  Again, nothing overly complicated….but some practice on scraps can be useful to sort out your technique as well as really thinking many steps ahead. The picture below shows a stained boat with some lines that came out nice but the lines were a lot of extra work.
3. Dark stains under a hot sun can make for a very hot boat – so hot that the epoxy can start to  bubble and delaminate.    I have seen this problem a number of times with my darker boats..and it was very frustrating.  The solution, however, was pretty simple, do not park a dark stained kayak in direct sunlight for any significant amount of time on a hot summer day, park it in the shade.  Alternatively, use a stain to create a light color.   I did this in the second boat below because I was so frustrated with how hot the boat was becoming in the heat.  It works very well.

Anyway, I hope that answered your question and was helpful.

h

   Thanks h !  Amazingly useful.

building strip microbootleeger sport

  I have just applied first coat of epoxy over glass mat over untreated strips.  I stained the strips using behlen stain to the water line with natural timber from there on

Found that  the epoxy absorbed some of the colour so that as I spread the epoxy from the stained section to unstained a the epoxy became tinted. I used a west system spreader and west system 105 expoxy. 

I have watched all of nicks video on the build process and followed the process 

has anyone had a similar experiance

regards Hamilton 

Hi Hamilton,

the short answer is 'yes' and that is what i was referring to when i said above that a lot of care is needed when you are trying to get a line or have stained and unstained parts.

basically, epoxy will lift the stain and if you are trying to maintain a line....there is some additional masking/steps required.

the first step is to mask off the area where you don't want the stain, then you need to apply a 'fixing coat' of epoxy swiftly (to minimize stain being moved around) on top of the stain (this is a very light and quick coat of epoxy.) to lock the stain in place.   then you do a reverse fix coat masking off the epoxy coated stained part of the line and fix the part that has no stain.

now that all the stain and unstained parts are 'fixed' and the epoxy has locked the stain in place (and you have cleaned up any issues)....then you proceed to glassing.

to make a long story short, stain needs to be 'fixed' in place with thin coat of epoxy to keep it from lifting and moving around in the glassing step.

h

   Thanks hspira

I had figured that would be the case.  Odd that Nick S didn't mention this on any of the microBootlegger sport series of videos.  Anyway, not much I can do now, luckily the bleed is on the hull near the water line so hopefully it won't get noticed - except by me

I went and had a look at Rob Mack's from laughing loon and he applies a thin coat of epoxy before the cloth so I'll try that method on the deck

live and learn

hamilton 

Hi Hamiton, 

i am sure its going to look great....and yes to the learning and living :)

fwiw my boats have blemishes like this if you zoom in and look hard.....so i know how you feel.

just for the sake of the community and the video's....i would note that Nick uses several techniques to get lines and, i suppose through his acquired school of hard knocks, sorts out each situation amongst his several techniques of stains and lines and effect he is trying to get....to make it work.

sometimes he actually builds the different colored parts seperately (so the stain is fixed) and joins them together with clear....and sometimes, he stains the whole boat and you don't need to worry about the stain moving around....and sometimes he has a combination of techniques.....

as mentioned above, the short version of the story is anytime there is 'unfixed' stain...the immediate next coat ofepoxy will move it around.....and if you don't want that, you need to plan ahead for that....

h

  ".... Odd that Nick S didn't mention this on any of the microBootlegger sport series of videos......"

As I recall the MicroBootlegger  was stained, both deck and hull. Both were same color. 

He did do a  light colored line on a Petrel Play stripper and sealed the light colored wood with CA glue to protect it from the stain. He is, as said before, staining seperate parts of the current film project, Petrel Play SOG.