New Build??

I am thinking about starting another boat, something light that I can easily handle alone (to and from the water, not that young anymore). Right now the players are the 11 foot little auk, the nymph canoe or the petrel play. The petrel play is the front runner just because I like the lines. Does the petrel play (or any of these boats) need a skeg? I am in the pondering stage and any comments would be welcome. If I do this I would start in late summer, too much going on between now and then. Thanks Mike 


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RE: New Build??

Are you talking the S&G Petrel Play or the strip version?  I built a S&G version a few years ago and love it.  It does npot NEED a skeg but I did add one.  Without the skeg it tracks nicely when paddling but when you stop paddling the boat turns.  Adding the skeg made it much easier to take pictures.  Below is the review I wrote several years ago.

When I built my Petrel Play during the spring of 2014, the Play was only available as a kit from Chesapeake Light Craft or as plans from Guillemot Kayaks.  As of this writing, it appears that completed Petrel Plays will soon be available for purchase.  One of the former CLC employees, who still teaches classes for CLC, has started a small shop called Turning Point Kayaks, which will reportedly be offering custom built Petrel Plays in fiberglass, carbon fiber, Kevlar or wood strip.

The Petrel Play, which was my third kayak built from CLC kit, took me 5 months and 135 hours (59 work periods) to complete.  This is one of CLC’s latest generation of kits and it is a work of art.  Just as with older kits, all the wood panels are cut with puzzle joints and stitch holes predrilled.  What is added are bevels on the wood panels and external hull/deck forms which help hold the boat’s complex shape during construction.  The manual is also a work of art that is loaded with pictures and many of Nick Schade’s build techniques.  My only criticism is that this is a shared manual with the S&G Petrel and most pictures are of the Petrel and not the Petrel Play.  Despite the exceptional kit and manual, this is not a good choice for a first time builder.  The complex deck shape requires considerable bend on some of the panels which makes stitching difficult.  The complex shape also makes glassing pretty difficult.  My boat came in at 41.6# fully rigged.

The Petrel Play is a light and responsive kayak that may not be the best choice for a beginner, but experienced paddlers will love.  Primary stability is light and secondary is light to moderate.  The boat tracks nicely at speed but it will turn sideways as the boat slows once you stop paddling.  The boat has exceptional maneuverability and carves nice tight turns with a little lean. 

The Play is not a fast boat.  It moves effortlessly at 4 mph with minimal wake but the effort required increases markedly above that.  I am an athletic 5’7”/155# and can sprint the Play at 5.5-6.0 mph.  My two hour exercise pace is about 5.2 mph.

This is a great boat for rough conditions.  I have paddled it in 2’ chop and felt very secure.  It accelerates quickly and will surf on the smallest of waves.  There are some neat videos online showing the designer paddle the Play in extreme conditions.

For me, the cockpit in the Play is snug but comfortable for a couple of hours.  One of my taller friends (6’2” & thin) paddled the boat and found it tight.  I would not recommend this boat for a heavy person.

The Play could be used for light touring if you pack smartly.  The forward storage area is decent sized but the VCP hatch is small.  The aft hatch is much larger but the storage volume is less due to the low aft deck.

When I decided on the Play, I was looking for a smaller kayak for use in the many tight streams/springs in Florida, but was also capable of handling surf at the beach.  After a year of hard use, I am extremely pleased with my choice.  The Play is both a joy to paddle and a joy to look at.  Frankly, the only negative is that I frequently get delayed at the launch by other kayakers drooling over my boat.

 

 

RE: New Build??

The real question is does your paddling style require a skeg?  If you are a low angle relaxed paddler you'll likely need a skeg. If you are a high angle paddler with a purpose the skeg is less needed. Having one makes it capable of being used. I recommend it.    

RE: New Build??

   MarkN, Thanks, a very informative post, the boat is beautiful, I have always admired your fleet. I was actually thinking of the strip version and allocating two years for the build.  The strip version would be a more challenging build but I think I can build a lighter boat and extend my paddling career. Was your skeg install a kit?  I have an Oru Beach that I bought used, it is light, stable and has a lot of room but it just does not measure up to my CLC Boat. 

Grumpy, I am a low angle relaxed paddler. I just like being on the water and I like looking at my boats when I am home. I think I will go with a skeg.  Thanks, your responses have always been useful. Mike

 

RE: New Build??

I just purchased the Numph 12, myself. I’m looking forward to the build, itll be my first.   

RE: New Build??

Hi Robert, 

you are spot on that if you want light, you need to build with cedar.

i have built the petrel strip below and its all in weight is about 32 lbs

  

i also recently completed a 15 foot version of the frej that all in is about 25 lbs

the petrel will definitely need a skeg.  there are a couple options from build it yourself to get one pre-made.  my particular preference, if i buy a skeg is Superior Kayaks skeg kit.  it is all fibreglass and pretty much bullet proof engineering and very reasonably priced.  making your own isn't overly difficult if you have the time.

fwiw, i have also looked closely at the strip built petrel play as a project in the upcoming year or so.   based on how i typically build these...my sense is that it can be executed easily in the low 30 lbs range with a bit of care.   

happy to offer tips for a light build if you would like.  i have written on the postings here in the past about the general engineering for a light yet still sturdy boat.

h

 

RE: New Build??

 H Thanks, I have all of your 'light build tips' copied into a word document and they will be my guidelines on this build.  I am sure I will have questions. I do not have your access to CLC (I live in Utah) but I have a friend who has a machine that will 'shave' my strips evenly on both sides. Mike 

RE: New Build??

   

Hello Mike.  Thanks for the complement.  A random series of thoughts follow:

From what I have read, the strip and S&G versions of the PP handle very similarly, so I expect that you will love it.

On the down side, the PP has lots of curves and several chines which will make it a relatively tough strip build.  No doubt that the Auk or Nymph would be much easier.  I suggest that watching Nick’s video series detailing a PP build will be a huge help.

You have a couple of choices regarding strips that you will use in the build.  I used staples and ¼” bead/cove strips on my first two strip builds, which is what I’d advise if this is your first strip build.  You can save some weight by building with 3/16” but it is harder to get B/C in the narrower strips.  I am currently building a Mystery with 3/16” hull and 1/8” non-B/C strips.  I find the thinner strips easier to build but hand beveling each strip takes time.  If you do go without B/C, buy the Robo-Bevel. 

Although I love the visual effect, I recognize that I added considerable weight to my first strip build (Wahoo) through use of wood other than western red cedar.  Nogul (Peruvian Walnut) is 2x heavier and Alaskan Yellow Cedar is 1.25x heavier compared to WRC.  Both are also harder to bend, plane and sand.  I am more concerned with weight on the Mystery build so I only used a bit of AYC.

I have skegs in three of my boats, the CLC kit in a 17LT and KayakSport in the PP and Frej.  The CLC kit is very robust but it extends up through the deck so I would not use it on the strip build.  The KayakSport skeg is very easy to install and works well in both of the other boats.

Couple of skeg picts in my wife's Freg.

 

RE: New Build??

   MarkN I helped a friend build a 17 foot strip canoe and I built my own Chesapeake 16, which I love, but looking forward I need something lighter when I just want to go out on my own. I take a lot of photographs when I paddle and my body does not bend as easily as it used to so I am going with practical. I love the petral lines but I am going to build the more stable, larger cockpit 11 foot little auk. The friend I mentioned above has the equipment to shave 1/4 inch B/C evenly on both sides to 3/16. I plan to use hspira's notes to shave as much weight as I can. Thank you for the skeg pictures, I have added 'kayaksport skek' to my notes. This will be a late July start and it will be a slow build. If I can figure out how to get pictures on this forum I will post as I make progress and I am sure I will ask questions. You and hspira were very helpful on my Chesapeake. Mike  

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