NE Dory rigging: forestay/jib tack to painter

Hi, in the midst of building a NE Dory and I'm confused on the manual's instructions on the forestay/jib rigging. 

In the book they've spliced a snap shackle into the inboard portion of the painter to attach the jib tack, but they do not show the forestay. Is it the same snap shackle? I assume you would need two snapshakles secured to the painter, one for the forestay tensioned with nylon lashings, and one for the tack of the jib? The manual also says "the shrouds (and the jib halyard) should be as taut as banjo strings" implying that the jib halyard would be taught before you rake/plumb the mast. What am I missing here?

Also, what rope is recommended for the painter? 3 braid to splice in snap shackle(s)? Would a bowline be the alternative to splicing? 

Thanks!


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RE: NE Dory rigging: forestay/jib tack to painter

Three strand is much easier to splice for civilians, but it has a bunch of stretch to it.  A bowline on polyester double braid is a better solution for anything that should stay taut if you can't to that splice (it's pretty tricky, especially on small diameter rope < 3/8").

There's a yellow/orange double braid with blue fleck made of polypropylene that makes a good floating painter, but once again tricky to splice.

The old double it back on itself and stitch the crap out of it is not a bad solution since the loads are minimal compared to the breaking strength of the rope.  Not quite as sexy as a real splice but much cleaner than a bowline.  You can also cover the "splice" with heat shrink to make it even nicer looking.

RE: NE Dory rigging: forestay/jib tack to painter

 

   I'm not sure what you mean by "painter" here.  A painter is usually the line to the bow eye used to tie up the boat or tow it.  You mean the pennant that goes down into the bow on the backside of the bow eye?

The NE dories that I've seen had a fore stay and the jib was hanked to the forestay in the usual fashion.  However, the forestay eye and tack are clipped together to the pennant fixed into the bow.  John Harris explained this in an old posting here, and others contributed some photos that are pretty explanatory.  As he explains it, the forestay only is there to take loads when the jib is not hoisted.  Once the jibe is hoisted, its luff takes the load.  Check out this forum thread:

http://www.clcboats.com/forum/clcforum/thread/30902.html

RE: NE Dory rigging: forestay/jib tack to painter

Thanks guys, helpful.  

Mummichog, the Painter on the Dory sits through a hole eight or so inches beneath the bow and is secured through the hull with a stopper knot, the inboard piece of which secures the jib tack and forestay--I believe they refer to it as the painter because the piece outboard of the bow can be used as a tie up/tow line. Some photos I've seen leave this fairly long, coiled and brought over the rail to sit in the bow (I suppose in lieu of cleats). Is this what you mean by pennant? 

RE: NE Dory rigging: forestay/jib tack to painter

   I tied two loops to the inside extension of the painter and spaced them so that the forestry connected to one and the jib connected to the other

RE: NE Dory rigging: forestay/jib tack to painter

   Went over to Amazon and got myself a splice kit--always a good skill to have in your back pocket. 

RE: NE Dory rigging: forestay/jib tack to painter

Hey Will U. if you need any help splicing let me know.  What kit did you order.  I like the Samson aluminum for double braid and the Point Hudson PHID for three strand.  But you can get by with the cheap West Marine swedish fid.

RE: NE Dory rigging: forestay/jib tack to painter

   Will do! I got some whipping twine along with this guy:

https://www.amazon.com/Ronstan-RF823002-Splicing-Kit/dp/B00QL5Y2H0/ref=sr_1_1?s=sporting-goods&ie=UTF8&qid=1509544155&sr=1-1&keywords=Ronstan+Splicing+Kit&dpID=41pHm5SB0%252BL&preST=_SY300_QL70_&dpSrc=srch

Looks like it should get me by (with all the expertise I've gleamed from youtube).

Any other tool you'd recommend?

RE: NE Dory rigging: forestay/jib tack to painter

I actually have a set of Selma fids on my boat but I never really figured out how to use them.  They don't have the short fid/long fid marks on them that I'm used to using.  They do nest and are stainless, which is wy I bought them for the boat.

This is the set I use, minus the pusher.  I have these fids all the way up to 1" (which is basically an aluminum baseball bat).

All of these fids are for double braid.  You can use one of these for three strand.  I'd grind the point down a bit more though.

https://www.amazon.com/Sea-Dog-Line-Splicing-hollow-splicing/dp/B00DH399B8/ref=sr_1_4?s=sporting-goods&ie=UTF8&qid=1509566347&sr=1-4&keywords=swedish+fid

I don't see a way to PM, but if you give me your email address, I'll shoot you the procedures I wrote up for splicing.

RE: NE Dory rigging: forestay/jib tack to painter

   oh cool, that'd be great. I'm at upshurwp@gmail.com.

Thanks!

RE: NE Dory rigging: forestay/jib tack to painter

Hey Will,

Sent you double braid and three strand splicing instructions.  Anyone else interested?

RE: NE Dory rigging: forestay/jib tack to painter

 How's this for small-diameter double-braid splicing? :-)

This is what happens when one is stuck on a slow phone call and has a piece of old broken bootlace at hand. Think of it as the adult fidget toy.

For my fid I used a plastic coffee stirrer and I secured things while in progress with scotch tape. If you look carefully, the whole world is about boatbuilding.

Laszlo

 

RE: NE Dory rigging: forestay/jib tack to painter

   Ha, very nice. 

And Lazlo, thanks for the wrinkly fiberglass help two week's ago (I was the young guy in the NE Dory build). Going to be putting some QT in this weekend, hope to finish the outer hull.

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