Madness appendages

Very interested in Madness but also very concerned about going aground with it.  Cruising the Chesapeake or west coast of Florida, shallow draft sailing is essential.  Hitting a sand bar at 15 knots will likely cause catastrophic damage.

Any thought given to a shallow draft rudder or possibly even a segmented rudder that could be operated at a half depth?

 


6 replies:

« Previous Post       List of Posts       Next Post »

RE: Madness appendages

 

>>>>Very interested in Madness but also very concerned about going aground with it.  Cruising the Chesapeake or west coast of Florida, shallow draft sailing is essential.  Hitting a sand bar at 15 knots will likely cause catastrophic damage.

Any thought given to a shallow draft rudder or possibly even a segmented rudder that could be operated at a half depth?
>>>>>>>>>>

 

This question comes up a lot in proa circles.  There's dissonance, though, because when is it ever normal for a 15-knot sailboat to be able hit things without being damaged?  It's like asking a supersonic aircraft to double as a crop-duster.  I just don't hear the trimaran and catamaran crowd talking about going 15 knots in 20 inches of water.  (A Farrier F-24 draws 56" with the daggerboard down.)

Sailboats that can do an honest 15 knots---in trials so far, 15 knots is just loafing along for this boat---are as rare in the sailboat world as supersonic aircraft are rare in the sky.  There are lots of 15+ knot sailboats with cruising accommodations and kick-up appendages, but they aren't Hobie Cats.  They cannot hit something at high speed without at least minor damage.

As you would in a supersonic jet, you throttle up only once you are clear of traffic and obstacles.  Like sandbars.  Madness lives on the Chesapeake, and in a very shallow part of it at that.  I've run aground 4 or 5 times in the few short months I've had the boat, and will run aground many times in the future.  I was only going 6 knots or so (ONLY!  My, how you change your frame of reference with multihulls).  As planned, the result was that I lifted the offending board, got over the shoal, and moved on with zero damage.  Hit a shoal in ANY 31-foot sailboat at 15 knots, and you're going to break something.  They can't even engineer automobiles to survive 5mph impacts without damage.

I don't go to afterburners until I'm clear ahead for miles, with at least 43 inches of depth.  Most sailboats on the Chesapeake have a fixed draft of more than 43 inches.  You can do a lifetime of exploration on the Chesapeake in 43-inch+ water.  When I need to get into thin water, as I do every single time I dock, I lift the boards and maneuver with the outboard, at a maximum draft of about 16"----the same that PocketShip draws with the board up.  Coincidentally, PocketShip draws 43" with the board all of the way down!


 

 

 

RE: Madness appendages

Wow! I can't tell if that guy is upset or excited about John's post!

George K

RE: Madness appendages

Yes, that's true, with Tri's and Cats, you can have a kick-up rudder, and daggerboards can always be lifted.

I grew up crusing the Chesapeake in a Folkboat with a 4' draft.  We ran aground all over the bay.  Maybe just poor seamanship, but I would go to great lengths with the build to have the option to short cut over a bar or sneak into an anchorage under sail.

 

RE: Madness appendages

A Folkboat person!?  Cool.  Here's mine, a 1971 Marieholm, on the Chesapeake:

Currently stored behind the building at CLC.  The poor thing donated its Harken self-tailers to the proa.  Madness-the-proa started out as a design exercise: What could I do with PocketShip's pile of plywood, and the Folkboat's rig?  (PocketShip and Madness are within a couple of pounds of the same rigged displacement.)

I sailed this one engineless all over the Chesapeake, running aground often.  (Draft, 48".)  Mine was much cosseted.  It might be the best-handling displacement sailboat ever---not bad for a 1940's design.  

 

 

 

RE: Madness appendages

John,

Completely agree on the Folkboat, ours was a Marieholm 76.  It has spoiled me as every boat I've been on since couldn't measure up.   Always in control no matter the conditions.

Working on a rudder design.

Mark

« Previous Post     List of Posts     Next Post »


Please login or register to post a reply.