Ballasting a Mill Creek 16.5 to sail with one?

My wife and I built a Mill Creek 16.5 some time ago now and have paddled and sailed it, and even camped and toured with it. Now we have a toddler, so sailing it isn't really an option now there's three of us. We have paddled our little boy on quiet canals and he has slept on my wife's lap in the front of the cockpit.

I've tried sailing on my own, but the I had real problems in getting it to go anything other than downwind. I'm suspecting that it's because I'm steering from the back, and the bow is almost out of the water. My suspicion is that without the weight up front, the stern is dragging through the water and therefore the rudder has little effect.

I'm not really a sailor, but since I've had success with the two of us could someone give us any advice here for sailing with one (me) at the back?

I think the answer might be to ballast to a similar weight up front (possibly less if I can bring the weight nearer to the bulkhead rather than concentrated around the front seat). I have a load of 5 litre plastic containers and I wondered if these were filled with water at the shoreline then they would add 5kg each, and yet wouldn't be difficult to carry. I've put some webbing loops around the bulkhead hatch, so restraining them should also be possible.

Ideas please, or am I going around this the wrong way?

Some photos on my Facebook page...


9 replies:

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RE: Ballasting a Mill Creek 16.5 to sail with one?

You may want to consider the CLC Kayak/Canoe SailRig to stabilize your mill creek while sailing.  I have seen pictures of it being used with a mill creek.

Great picture of the shark.

 

RE: Ballasting a Mill Creek 16.5 to sail with one?

Ivan, 

I would  try moving to the forward seat position for single handed sailing.  This should help balance the canoe.  Adding weight will only slow you down.  Further, with too much weight in the stern, the center of resistance of the boat gets too far behind the center of effort of the sail, which hurts upwind sailing, and may even prevent the boat from tacking through the wind.  I know, it happened to me.

By the way, what size sail are you using?

 Bob

RE: Ballasting a Mill Creek 16.5 to sail with one?

MarkB... Yeah, I'd really love the sailing option, but our little boy takes up a fair amount of my time and I wouldn't want to be stuck in the workshop for that long. Cost is a bit of an issue now, too. Also, I'm not sure if our car would take all of that stuff.

Bob... "Too much weight in the stern"?! I've been working on that, but the chocolate is too tempting these days ;-)  I like the idea of moving to the forward seat position, but wasn't sure if I'd get tangled up if I rolled the boat. Also, not too sure if the sheet would be too far back to control easily, although I could put in a pulley (sheave? block? - I told you I wasn't a sailor) and bring it forward I suppose.

You're right about the centre of resistance/centre of effort thing. Fortunately the wind was blowing pretty well straight along the river I was sailing, so the complete lack of steering was thankfully not too problematic, although I could only go downwind and not practice other manouevers. Tacking was impossible.

I wondered if by replacing my wife with 5 litre plastic bottles (shhhh, don't tell her) whether I could retain my back seat driving, but I can see that it would be slower. I was inspired by another MC16.5 owner (Chris H) who posted on this forum who used his "...daughter as ballast"

Our sail is 7' by 7' as shown on Fyne boat kits website

Thanks for your advice so far, and I'd be grateful for any other ideas.

Ivan

RE: Ballasting a Mill Creek 16.5 to sail with one?

One last thought about water balast.  You might want to check out some wakeboarding /waterskying sites - for portable water balast sacks.   Apparently these boats have to be perfectly balanced to work properly and they have derived systems of water balasting tubes that they electronically pump water in and out of to maintain perfect balast under variable conditions.  These tubes can add up to 100 lbs of balast each, and to cut costs you could probably rig up a manual/foot pumping system to pump water in and out of the balast sack as needed for sailing.

RE: Ballasting a Mill Creek 16.5 to sail with one?

I'm hoping that the boat doesn't need to be perfectly balanced in order to work. I'm not racing and it was to aim for an alternative to paddling rather than get the maximum speed. An interesting idea, though, if I had to get every last bit of speed out.

 I think I'll try the containers to pull the front down when we get a chance to get near a lake or the local estuary. I like the back position even if it is a bit clumsy, since I'm tall and I don't know how much "Boom!" my head can take.

Still interested in other MC16.5 users, as there don't seem to be many of us sailing the boat.

Cheers, Ivan

RE: Ballasting a Mill Creek 16.5 to sail with one?

Hi Ivan,

 I'm the one accused of using the daughter as ballast. While this does  work fine, I usually sail mine solo without any problems. Have you tried adjusting the position of the lee board? Ounce mine is down the boat will point anywhere I want and stay there. If I'm paddleing it solo without the board it does exactly what you describe by trying to point the bow downwind. That's caused by the bow being completely out of the water without someone in the front seat. My suggestion would be to move your board forward which should cause the balance of the sailrig to weather helm and hopefully solve the problem without needing ballast.

 

   Chris

 

RE: Ballasting a Mill Creek 16.5 to sail with one?

Id opt for the MKII especially because of the child.  Im assuming this child has their own flotation vest. Anything less is...

 

Anyway - seriously, you want upwind ability, speed and then some and the security of a stable ride - you cant pick a better option. There is no second choice.

 

Pete 

RE: Ballasting a Mill Creek 16.5 to sail with one?

It looks as if the topic is drifting, a bit like my sailing. I was hoping to be able to sail the kayak on my own with my wife looking after our little boy!

 If I had the time, money and energy, I'd be going for the PocketShip, but there we go...

Ivan

RE: Ballasting a Mill Creek 16.5 to sail with one?

Chris... I think it was Laszlo that discussed lee-board position and he maintains that it has to be at the widest point of the boat. I can see how moving it forwards might be the answer, though.

I wish I could find the relevant forum post as the arguments seemed pretty convincing. Having said that, I've also seen photos (on the fyneboatkits website) of lee board positions that are forward of the front seat of the MC16.5, so you're not the only one doing it.

PeteProa... our boy has only been on a very shallow canal (mostly shallow enough to wade in, and only just wide enough to turn the MC16.5 around in, and even then he's in a lifejacket. He's much to precious to take risks with. He's certainly not ready for the open water, IMO.

 Ivan

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